2007-06-11 // 03:20:57
jenellenorris
I don't want to turn this into a 'whose country thought up horrid ways to treat people first' competition, but in 1881 the Congress of America basically invented the 'reservation state', Oklahoma. Before that, in 1938, thousands of Cherokee (general Cherokee, not just the one Cherokee tribe) were forced to walk to this state (most dies along the way which is why it's known as the Trail of Tears) and to live on its baron land.

English protestants are, historically, barbarians here in the US. Although I don't think anyone would disagree that the Third Reich certainly managed to out-do their barbarianism, I think it's safe to say that the both they and the English took notes for the Boer Wars.

Also, particularly for those who have traveled to Asia, the swastika is an everyday item, it just happened to be bastardized by the Reich. But surely you can see how people (particularly Europeans) can take offense to this.

In my time in Poland, I learned a lot about the Nazi invasion and occupation. I was taken to Jewish cemeteries that locals referred to as 'our shame' (they were ashamed of the fact that there were no Jews left to take care of them, not because of their existence) and I came to understand why Pols aren't terribly fond of Germans (I speak broadly, here).

Pols still have a LOT of cultural anger from the war and those I spoke with about it say that they don't think Germany has learned anything; that Germany is still run by fascists that will try again despite the EU; that Germans killed their people and that Germany should be 'removed' from the map (along with France since they surrendered.)

This is just what I heard from the people I met in the countryside of one country. I can only imagine how many other people throughout Europe STILL have deep-seated anger/resentment/hatred, etc. for the war and I have to admit, throwing a swastika in any of their faces can't feel good although I do know your point all-to-well (that it's an ancient symbol, etc.). As a Native American and an African American, if someone threw a confederate flag in my face, I'd might well hit them (okay, I wouldn't, but I'd really want to)

Many people have died under these symbols. Of course people will take offense to his work. Regardless of their offense, I do support your right to make it/create it/display it, I just think you should think carefully about you choose to display it.

Sorry, that was too long! I'll try to get more to the point next time.

J-

2007-06-05 // 00:15:13
joel
That's the same in Belgium , if you wear a svastika t-shirt you going to jail ... it proof that the nazis , killed so many people for really stupids reasons , but also "killed "a so old cultural symbol ...only for mass marketing and brain wash ...


ps: i didn't know for 45th Finish air force division ... nice to know it .
^
Hi, ok thanks - did not know that it was illegal in Belgium also. God, the world never learns, to ban and hide things is never the best way to deal with problems - funny, imagine if the Swastika became the symbol of gay love - every facist thug would soon give it up then yes? - a much better way te he Cheers Paul

2007-06-04 // 23:28:56
reddude945
thank you! but this site would be nothing if there was not people like you to shake things up! and no worries i don't think your a nazi! : D
^
cheers,I try my best !now where did I leave those jack boots:)

2007-06-04 // 22:59:14
reddude945
I see your point but it almost seems in bad taste to display the swatstika, just like in usa it is in bad taste to display the confederate flag. today both are symbolic of hate, ignorance. And it is almost foolish to belive they will ever make a "comeback" as a socially acceptable symbol. : |
(I'm not saying you are foolish of course! : ))
^
Hi, maybe you are right, I don't know, I just throw up a picture or comment like this every now and again as I think if "art" can not provoke people to think about risky issues then what's it for? Anyway I'm always glad to be the fool if it brings a bit of life to this site rather than just leave it to a stream of drivel and self-promotion. As you can guess I'm not running for "Mr popular" and certainly have no interest in things such as SotD. If people are offended by this picture - good it has served a purpose. I'm offended by any religeous picture but would defend anyones right to their belief and their right to post such pictures, I just choose to ignore them, as they can this picture. I lost two Grandparents to the Nazis and so I have no love of them I can assure you, I've seen people hacked to pieces for walking out from the "wrong church" and set on fire for praying to the wrong false godand been shot at by religeous lunatics and so I will handle any critical comments in my stride. Anyway I love your work and the passion you put into this site :)

2007-06-04 // 22:23:10
arnevandermeer
i think you canīt walk a mile in germany without facing our past. at least, if you take a look.

2007-06-04 // 21:56:55
arnevandermeer
hmm. you wonīt believe it, but in fact it IS banned in germany. youīl face jail if you display it.
^
ha, that says it all - can't hide your past -face it - deal with it. We Brits have done terrible things around the world long before the Nazis - we invented the concentration camp during the Boer War for example but we face our hsitory good and bad, nothing is banned just discussed and that way we move forward, it's a healing process to talk about things.

2007-06-04 // 21:11:22
arnevandermeer
hmm. although i hate to say this: but displaying a swastika today is (normally) no sign of some ancient indogermanic cult.
i think itīs similar to calling somebody "wanker" ..yeah. on the one hand, that is some normal behaviour..but itīs an insult nonetheless.
funny, but somehow the christians manged to keep their cross-sign "clean" of some million witches burnt.

^
well do we ban it, force it underground to be used by idiots like the Nazis or allow it to be viewed and discussed and maybe regain it's original meaning. Open mind, open heart :))))

2007-06-04 // 21:07:18
sikost
Hey!

Great to see someone aware of all this...
I have lots of little swastikas in patterns tattoo on me, love the swastika!
And once you get the "eye" for it you will find them in a lots of patternes around the world without people realising it...they are everywhere it's crazy!
Will post some photos of the swastika tattoos for you to have a look!
Peace!!

Ps: Arne, i understand what you feel about it...but realise that it has been used for 3000 years as a good luck sign...maybe it is time to get the swastika free from all this horror!!
^
Ok good stuff - the balls are in the air and as ever I expect a right royal stink from some. The sign as you say was a sign of peace for 99% of its history - peace to everyone especially those with clarity of thought not be brainwashed. I'm completely against what the Nazis did and i love everyone:)

2007-06-04 // 20:58:28
arnevandermeer
hmm. sorry. being german i certainly know about most of these facts..and is some nice geometrice form, no doubt about it. but in my opinion it is connected to so much horror and bloodshed ( probably more murder than was even thinkable in ancient times) that i canīt regard it as an ancient "symbol" or "neutral" anymore..except if i would find it in some chinese tomb.

^
mmm, true to an extent, but the Nazi form was different and just because they perverted it should it never be seen or views aired? The church (all kinds) kas killed millions more than the Nazi's ever did but do we hide the cross from sight and ban it - food for thought. I hate what the Nazis did, but they owned a version of this symbol for less than 20 years in a 3000 year history.